Bb512 no sparkagain

Tom,

sounds like the Perma-

Tom,

sounds like the Perma-tune packed up. I haven't had one go bad in a week...but....I'd get on the phone first thing in the morning with Lonnie and get him to take care of the situation.

I'm not much of a believer in coincedence, so the CD Box is where I'd concentrate my efforts.

If a worker jumped the car and popped the box are they really going to fess up ?

Please keep us up to speed on what Lonnie says.

Regards, JRV

I talked to perma-tune and the

I talked to perma-tune and they don't think it's the box(obviously) I have been doing a bunch of wiring checks, and all seems to be good. Is it possiable that the distributor pick-up magnet went south for the winter? I have tried to locate one of these things but nobody has one,and the only way you can get it is to buy a complete distributor....which by the way nobody has either. This pick must give out and analog signal to the ignition box. The from the box it goes to tach in the car. While I'm cranking the engine the tach in the car does not move at all. Not even a little jump..nothing. This is why I'm thinking the pick-up is not working.

My question to you is have you ever seen this happen? Have you ever had to replace a distributor on a BB512 for this reason? It seems rather strange to me...but at the same time it's all that is left in the circiut to check!! If I do find a distributor I'll bet it won't be cheap either. AAArrrgggg!!!

JRV or anybody. Do you have a wiring diagram for this car for the ignition system? If you do is there anyway that you could scan it and e-mail it to me? [email protected]
Once again I thank you for all your help

Tom

Tom,

never seen a hall effe

Tom,

never seen a hall effect sender in a distrib go bad yet. The distribs themselves (flywieghts) don't last long enough for the hall effect senders to go bad.

You can test the distrib trigger with an MSD if you have one laying around. Pull the distrib and hook up some temporary wires and spin the distrib with the coil wire near ground.

I'll look for a wiring diagram and see what I can do. Also I have a few old Boxer Distribs upstairs, I'll pull one down and see if I can develop a Distrib Alone Test .

Regards, JRV

Tom,

I have a fair amount o

Tom,

I have a fair amount of knowledge and experience with the BB ignition systems...and can provide you with a pin-out diagram for the spark box.

JRVs test for the hall-effect unit is sufficient enough to determine if it's working properly. With the distributor unplugged from the harness, you should perform the same test to verify yours. Also, veify that this signal exists at the spark box connector (with the box unplugged.)

The hall effect pick-up output, in itself, is not enough of a signal to trigger a tachometer response...as the spark box provides amplification of the trigger pulse. Hense, no tach movement on cranking doesn't point to a fault.

True, the pick-up units are not available seperately, though some distibutors have a spare mounted on them that is not used...and can be swaped with a suspected bad one.

Basically, there are four tests that need to be done.

1- Verify voltage at the spark box, using the box itself as the reference ground. If the spark box is isolated from the chassis ground, and the box itself is not grounded properly...the ignition system will not work reliably.

2-Verify voltage at the coil on cranking. This test may be non-conclusive if the box is not receiving a signal from the hall-effect pickup.

3-Off car testing of the ignition coil

4-Verify pulse, waveform, etc. from hall-effect unit.

If there's voltage at the spark box, and it's receiving a pulse from the hall-effect unit...and the coil and coil wire test good, the problem points back to the box itself.

One thing that I have seen on numerous occasions is the wire spades have pushed out of the connectors between the spark box and the engine harness. A light tug on the wires (on the chassis side of the harness) will verify the solidness of the connections.

Please let me know if you need the wiring diagram/pin-out...and I'll dig it up for you.

Regards,
David

Yes David I could definatly us

Yes David I could definatly use the diagram..Thanks so much for your input!! I sent to box to Perma-tune to get it updated with thier high outpu system. Seeing that it is a high energy type ignition(along the same lines as an msd box) there is no "key on engine off" power at the coil. The coil is only fired when the box recives the tach signal from the pick-up in the distributor.. The box then "steps-up" the voltage producing a hotter spark. The new box came with an iginition coil and complete instructions on how to insatall the system using the exsisting wiring in the car.

I spent a few hours on the car today checking all connections and wireing condition. All seems o.k. I just feel I'm over looking something. This is were the wiring diagrams would be extremly helpful. I called Ferrari of Atlanta,and Trutlands to find out if a service manuel is available..guess what...NLA!!

Thanks again for all your helps guys I'm very greatful to you both!!

Tom,

Here's the pin-out

Tom,

Here's the pin-out for the spark box...

As you look into the wiring connector on the engine side of the harness, starting from the left upper pin:

Red->Coil (+)terminal
Black-> To Hall effect pick-up ground (at distributor)
Green-> To Hall effect pick-up stud (at distributor)

Now, starting from the right upper pin:

Yellow-> Coil (-) terminal
Yellow-> Power, switched from ignition switch
Brown-> To tachometer (signal output)

Note: The Brown and Green wires going to the hall-effect sender are a shielded pair.

HTH...

Regards,
David

Wrapping paper run!![IMG]http:

Wrapping paper run!!

Hi dave...I just figured it ou

Hi dave...I just figured it out today. It was a probem with the perma-tune unit all along. Needless to say I'm none to pleased. I have spend so much time playing with this car..walking up and down dead end streets. I don't really blame the guys at perma-tune as i did send it back to them to check it. They said it tested fine and sent it back to me.

I reinstalled it in the car and nothing. I then removed it from the car(again) and wired it up directly to the components with my own wiring. Still nothing.

I removed the distributor, coil,and box and set them up on a bench with my own home made test rig. Turning the distributor still prodced no spark. I then started to probe around the tach out put terminals with my test light hooked up to the postive terminal of the car battery I was using as a power supply. As soon as I touched(put power to) the tach termainl I got a flash of spark out of the coil. I then was able to spin the distributor and make the coil spark.

I got on the phone with Lonnie and told him what I found. He seems to agree that they may have over looked somthing in the box..or they got one with an intermintant transformer problem.

I tell ya I have never encountered a sitiation like this before. Going over everything ten times over and the problem remained. I wish I had of gone with my gut and asked Lonnie to swap me another box. But I was going by the fact that he told me the box was fine. I trusted him,and I beleive that he trusted his equipment that was telling him so.

Such is life in the big city i guess.